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Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: OneIanBaker 27 September, 2015 19:11

I'm pretty sure they are part of the quietways initiatives - see TfL link d-projects/quietways

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: LadyNorwood 30 September, 2015 15:57

The first meeting is tonight from 5pm until 8pm in All Saints Church - I can't make it unfortunately, hopefully someone will attend and update the forum on what went on??

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Pieman 30 September, 2015 22:06

We attended tonights meeting and were given the link below to complete a survey regarding the proposal

We were advised that Rosendale road was selected as it is the most direct route but looking at the proposed route (link below)
surely Calton Avenue on to College Road is more direct.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 30/09/2015 22:30 by Pieman.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 01 October, 2015 14:40

I also attended the meeting last night, and my impression was that it was very well attended and local residents were putting their opinions across.
It does appear to be a done deal that Rosendale Road will be a quietway. The possibility of closing the road to vehicles "is still an option". I asked (1) what vehicle counts have been undertaken on Croxted Road / South Croxted Road and Alleyn Park, and what were the projections for these roads should traffic be displaced from Rosendale Rd, and (2) what existing spare capacity is there on these roads and what would increased usage mean for journey times and what were the views of TfL in respect of the No3. bus route? The answer to these questions was that the information is not available as this work has not been undertaken. Draw your own conclusions on the competency of Sustrans and Lambeth BC as they came within an ace of closing Rosendale Road for a trial period of three months in November without applying any thought to the consequences for the community.
I agree with Pieman that College Road would be a far better alternative as it would make the route more direct, it is the best safe cycling road in Dulwich and most residents park their cars off the road. It is also effectively "part closed" due to the deterrent of the toll gate.
I hope there will be an equally strong showing at the next meeting!

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Pieman 01 October, 2015 16:22

If they intend to use Rosendale road there will have to be some form of traffic restrictions implemented as they have to get the traffic flow to below 3,000 for it to be classed as a quietway. We were advised by a member of Sustrans that it is currently 8,000 from research they had recently carried out. There are also currently survey strips in place on Chestnut Road and adjoining roads.
When we first asked if they were part of this proposal we were told no, but were then advised they are.

Another interesting fact that we were told was that they cannot do anything to A roads.

They also do not need to consult with residents for trial schemes.

All of the members from Sustrans we spoke to had little if any knowledge of the local area and the impact this proposal would have on the surrounding roads and estates.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 01 October, 2015 16:39

Interesting information, Pieman.

So, if their ambition is to reduce traffic from 8,000 per day to 3,000 or less the obvious question is where will the 5,000+ displaced vehicles go? Obviously guesswork but I suspect that most of it would go to Croxted Road / S Croxted Road. Where else could it go? Not a nice prospect for the residents on those roads.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Will Anderson 01 October, 2015 18:00

I'm surprised there haven't been more comments about last night's workshop with Lambeth/Sustrans. I agree with Brian's measured comments on the other thread. I too left yesterday's meeting feeling angry and frustrated. The workshop was an organisational shambles - just as their mail outs had been! Of course everyone left comments (on post-it notes when they had run out of comment sheets), coloured dots on one map and spaghetti lines on the other, but I really doubt that they will make much sense out of it all. I'm told by the Rosendale Road retailers that their meeting on Tuesday had been similar. Nearly everyone I've spoken to has been extremely unhappy about the lack of transparency. Let's see how the workshops on 10 and 14 Oct go, but I suspect that there'll be a lot of Freedom of Information requests being submitted if the transparency doesn't improve. Last night was a disgrace.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Katharine@Wigwam 06 October, 2015 20:30

An absolute shambles indeed. Decisions being made by people who don't know the local area at all.

Who is going to the meeting this Saturday? Apparently you have to register for a place and there are only 70 places. So, the first question that springs to mind is, what happens to those who don't get a place?!

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Dulwichdamsel 06 October, 2015 21:55

Dear Residents and interested parties

Due to the large turn-out at our first event last week weve decided to allocate 70 places in advance for each of the up-coming Co-Design events.

This is because with very large numbers it will be difficult for the process to work effectively. Allocating places will allow for people to work in small enough groups to discuss ideas and create designs, and have enough support from our facilitators and traffic engineers. Its essential that the exercise is genuine and functional, and that you are able to engage with the process in a meaningful way. See more information below on how the exercise will work.

We also really want as many people to participate as possible, and for everyone who wants to participate to get the opportunity to do so. Therefore if both events become fully subscribed we will schedule in a further event in order to include everyone.

I greatly appreciate your understanding in this matter. This email has been sent to over 400 recipients. Please pass on this information to your local contacts.

To request a place at one of the next two events please reply to this email with details of which event you would like to attend. I will respond to you by email to confirm your place.

Look forward to hearing from you
Many thanks

Workshop 2 (Co-design Workshop) Saturday 10th October 10.30am 1.00pm
Workshop 3 (Co-design Workshop) Wednesday 14th October 5.00pm 7.30pm

The Co Design workshop:

Begins with a presentation including an explanation of how the process will work and information about the kind of options available to us.

We will then break into small groups. Each group will have a large scale map of the area and a tool box of options to work with.

You will be able to experiment with placing different tools in different places and in different combinations. There will be a Sustrans or Lambeth Council facilitator in each group and floating traffic engineers who will be able to give more detailed advice and clarification to questions.

You will be able to discuss the issues and options in your groups and then draw your own conclusions. Everyone will have their own design sheet. This is where you specify what you would like to see in the concept designs.

Sustrans makes smarter travel choices possible, desirable and inevitable. We`re a leading UK charity enabling people to travel by foot, bike or public transport for more of the journeys we make every day. It`s time we all began making smarter travel choices. Make your move and support Sustrans today.

Sustrans Limited. Registered Office - Sustrans, 2 Cathedral Square, College Green, Bristol, BS1 5DD. Registered Charity 326550 (England & Wales), SC039263 (Scotland). Company Limited by Guarantee No: 1797726 Company Registered in England.

Sponsor a Mile of the National Cycle Network, the perfect gift for every cyclist.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Dulwichdamsel 06 October, 2015 22:04

Apparently 210 people added their names to the contact sheet at the first consultation evening last Wednesday which was reported as a shambles
Perhaps any interested parties should register quickly to ensure they have one of the 70 allocated places this Saturday morning. I do not think this is nearly enough and Sustrans should arrange 4 co-design workshops to ensure sufficient capacity including a separate meeting for businesses & organisations such as the 15 local schools

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: ally 07 October, 2015 00:58

Thank you for your information Pieman. Yes, at the Consultation last Wednesday it was clear that the Sustrans people were interested only in Rosendale Road. They appeared not to know or care what effects the Quietway would have on other local roads or junctions. I don't imagine the Workshops are meant to address those issues either but I urge everyone to attend to put across the wider picture as forcefully as possible

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: LadyNorwood 07 October, 2015 12:52

I have asked to be included on Wednesday 14th October; I have also asked whether Southwark Council are being consulted and/or represented as they are responsible for the maintenance of Croxted/South Croxted Road and is also the borough into which this ridiculous proposed route is scheduled (east of Croxted Road)..... Also how can a charity, Sustrans, have such influence on such a huge issue???

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 08 October, 2015 15:03

There is another thread about the Loughborough Road / Milkwood Road shambles and I believe that the attached article from The Standard earlier this week describes what has happened there.

Attachments: DSC_0306.JPG (271.1KB)  
Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 08 October, 2015 15:35

Further to the last post, here is a link to Brixton Buzz:

you will probably need to copy and paste the link into your browser

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Londoner 11 October, 2015 20:34

Got information today that Sustrans (the supposed facilitator seeking local views) has urged a (self confessed) cyclist activist to get more people who support measures on Rosendale Road to attend the meeting at All Saints Church on Wednesday 14th. Apparently Saturday's meeting was "dominated by" opponents of measures to filter out road traffic. Outrageous conflict of interest by Sustrans; indeed, as the agent of TfL, it must raise legal doubts about the whole process.

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Dulwichdamsel 11 October, 2015 22:38

Agreed, this needs to be investigated. Apparently the limited number of residents who were allowed to attend Saturdays meeting were reluctant to engage in nursery school exercises, Sustrans have no knowledge of the locality.
TFL and Lambeth need to take this matter seriously and attend the future meetings in place of Sustrans

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 16 October, 2015 11:58

Any feedback on the 14th October meeting? I am wondering if any of the cycling campaigners that "we come with an open mind" Sustrans were canvassing made an appearance

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: vialli 16 October, 2015 12:05

There is also quite a debate going on about the wider scheme on the East Dulwich Forum.....

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: ally 17 October, 2015 01:19

Yes, it is interesting to see how fiercely the route and the car v. cycle question are debated on the East Dulwich forum and how many different schemes there are in the area. I don't envy whoever is responsible for the crossroads in Dulwich Village and the design for Carlton Avenue/Court Lane/Woodwarde .... It's also interesting to see one of the local councillors answering questions on the forum even if he is given a very hard time by some of the people posting.

Going back to the Rosendale Rd part of the scheme, I see Sustrans are putting on a third "co-design workshop" on Saturday 24th October which was originally given us as the date for the grandly named "Feedback Concept Showcase". Does anyone know if this will go ahead later, or will Sustrans take their ideas straight to the formal consultation with Lambeth, now apparently scheduled for January rather than November. As they say in Private Eye, I think we should be told!

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Lovelace 03 November, 2015 11:31

I have just joined this forum and have been catching up with the current thread.

I broadly support the idea of quietways but think that this one has been badly thought out and poorly consulted. I agree with someone's comment that College Road is on the face of it a better route than Turney / Rosendale as it is more direct to Crystal Palace, more pleasant for cyclists and already partially controlled. It also avoids Tritton, Clive, Hamilton and Gypsy Roads which are all problematic.

I would urge everyone, if not already done, to fill in Sustran's online survey which is still 'live' and only takes a few minutes. From experience these documents carry more weight than the perhaps confusing results of consultations and workshops, especially if these are badly organised.

The survey link is:

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: Dulwichdamsel 06 December, 2015 22:54

See new thread on Rosendale rd traffic, last time there were over 3000 views, even though it's a busy time of year I think we should keep up the level of local opposition to this

Re: Proposed bollards on Rosendale Road
Posted by: alanlondon 16 December, 2015 17:51

The address about the suggested alterations to Rosendale junctions. You will also be able to participate in an unashamedly biased survey organised by Sustrans to make your comments.

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